[ajug-members] ajug, (good)interesting experience...

Thu May 22 15:53:48 EDT 2008

Way to go Kerry! That was down right up lifting.

On Thursday 22 May 2008 1:21 pm, Kerry Wilson wrote:
> People are always happy to tell you why you cannot do something, no matter
> what it is.
>
> The easiest way to learn programming is to start a project, small at first,
> and build on it.
> Scratch your own itch.  So, you are a math teacher?  Maybe you should
> create a small website for your classes.
>
> 1. Learn HTML / Javascript / CSS - Make a site where you distribute lesson
> plans, quizzes, etc.
> 2. Add some Java (or ASP.NET *gasp*) - Maybe a login where people can see
> their grades, or a calendar app perhaps
> 3. Study Design Patterns and learn a framework - Is your website working
> for you?  Maybe you should package it for sell or host it for others
>
> Who knows if you do this you may not need someone else to hire you at all!
> It is a process for sure, for learning Java I recommend Core Servlets &
> JavaServer Pages.  It may be a little old, but I loved that book.  Once you
> are pretty familiar with servlets / JSP, you should be able to see why we
> need frameworks and start to learn one.  Spring MVC and JSF is pretty
> popular now, but who knows what it will be when you get to that point.  The
> steepest learning curve to me learning JEE was getting app server
> configuration down, but I that was doing everything myself.  Some hosts
> will help you with that.
>
> Good Luck,
>
> kerry
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: 521 [mailto:521 at ofig.org]
> Sent: Thursday, May 22, 2008 11:42 AM
> To: ajug-members at ajug.org
> Subject: Re: [ajug-members] ajug, (good)interesting experience...
>
> that is quite depressing, i understood why you said it though, as i was
> just
>
> throwing thoughts into a user-group email- i will respond with the
> following;
> i have spent a lot of time involved in (first) hardware, (second) tcp/ip,
> (third) web/html/ftp/stuff, (fourth) procedural programming, and finally
> (currently only about 1  yrs) oop/java... -maybe i'll stick with teaching
> 8th
> grade math...  :)
>
> this sounds like i am argueing, i am not though- maybe
> programming/logic/analysis/patterns is not for me; and i see what you are
> saying in that 'even' jr. programmer-positions (most of them) require 2-3
> yrs
> experience...  i guess i need those 3 and 4 hundred-level 'college' courses
> (thousands of hours) that would make the difference
>
> thanks for you input chris, good luck to you...
>
> my plan is to keep applying for programmer-jobs/positions
>
> barclay
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, 22 May 2008 09:46:16 -0400, Chris Abney wrote
>
> > What is java/flat-file/home-grown ?  
> >
> > The grammar in your email is not good.  This has nothing to do with
> > Programming but it has a lot to do with the kind of work you would be
> > expected to do as a programmer.
> > Most... Strike that.  All positions in IT will involve some degree of
> > technical writing.  
> >
> > Without being able to impress others with significant university level
> > academic experience in computer science you will need to have
> > significant project work to show.
> > Come up with a personal project - Some sort of program to design and
> > build.  Some people do free work for open source projects.
> > Build it; Then document it on the web.
> > Using book author quality technical writing, you should show that you
> > understand the design issues, design patterns, programming idioms and
> > how to write code.
> >
> > This should sound like a lot of work.  If you really want to get into IT
> > (programming anyway) just patently and consistently put in the hours.
> > Today, it is the rare exception that people begin a successful lasting,
> > careers as a programmer with just a desire and few continuing education
> > classes.
> > Remember, most of the people you are competing with spent a LOT of money
> > to be able to work 2 or 3 thousand hours a year (in college) to be able
> > to be programmers.
> > If you haven't done the equivalent, then you are asking for something
> > extra.
> >
> > The good news is - If you enjoy programming, a project like this should
> > be fun.
> >
> > Chris Abney
> > chris at abney.info
> > Former Java study group leader
> > Answerer of this question many times over
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: mcdaniel [mailto:521 at ofig.org]
> > Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2008 6:50 PM
> > To: ajug-members at ajug.org
> > Subject: [ajug-members] ajug, (good)interesting experience...
> >
> > good stuff there at ajug... -i smiled inside...
> > i'm a one-year java/oop programmer as i understand procedural
> > programming for a while- i was at the ajug last evening/night and was at
> > the eat-ery before-hand, i spoke with nice/helpful people there
> > (thanks).  i need help (i think)- i just passed java2 for programmers at
> > a local tech school- via, they used this product: learnkey.com [
> > http://www.learnkey.com/Java2_for_Programmers ]- with an above 80% grade
> > (which 'only' means i can 'tell' (some)one  /*casting*/ or 'do'
> > fair/basic java stuff)... at any rate- i like who/what i learned-about
> > last evening, and wanted to say the following-
> >
> > i can get interviews but can not get hired because the chicken came
> > before the egg, i mean the egg came before the chicken
> >
> > hire? no-experience; experience? no-hire...
> > -at rate(any)...
> > i liked the man that spoke, and i think the word 'vehicle' should be the
> > class for 'water', 'land', or 'air' as the type-of-shipping (as
> > boat/submarine, plane/helicopter , or truck/van/train)- shoot, there's
> > more categories (already...); however, i played it safe (as the
> > person-type that the speaker spoke-about) and said nothing- until the
> > end... (project-clean'up/project-pre'execution/what-ever-the-term(s));
> > thanks, i learned/was-able-to-understand-larger-issues from my time
> > spent; also, i was the one asking the question about interfaces which
> > lead to the bomb discussion [from the response(s)] from a few weeks ago-
> >
> > humor, maybe? (below):
> >
> > the interface is java's dynamic programming...-cast everything in a
> > switch/case
> >
> > i'm a php/mysql (ish) becomming java/flat-file/home-grown
> >
> > i'm asking-for, i guess... if one can give (if you have the time)
> > advise/comments for-getting-hired-via career change...
> >
> > http://ofig.org/it
> >
> > sincerely, -barclay
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > ajug-members mailing list
> > ajug-members at ajug.org
> > http://www.ajug.org/mailman/listinfo/ajug-members
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > ajug-members mailing list
> > ajug-members at ajug.org
> > http://www.ajug.org/mailman/listinfo/ajug-members
>
> _______________________________________________
> ajug-members mailing list
> ajug-members at ajug.org
> http://www.ajug.org/mailman/listinfo/ajug-members
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> ajug-members mailing list
> ajug-members at ajug.org
> http://www.ajug.org/mailman/listinfo/ajug-members

-- 
"Absolute security comes with chains."