[ajug-members] Wipro coming to Atlanta

Thu Aug 2 17:54:37 EDT 2007

What would I say to my congressman?

I've already forgotten which of the visa programs which is based on a
"lottery" system.  I personally think that stinks.  The best and brightest
should make the cut first. As we know, a single really talented "A team
player" can out produce 10 or more "B or C" players.

  _____  

From: ajug-members-bounces at ajug.org [mailto:ajug-members-bounces at ajug.org]
On Behalf Of Brian Whitfield / Essential Resources
Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2007 5:35 PM
To: 'General AJUG membership forum (100-200 messages/month)'
Subject: RE: [ajug-members] Wipro coming to Atlanta

Didn't mean to start a debate.  Just wanted to point it out.  For those of
you that see it as a negative - contact your congressman.  For those of you
that don't, then don't.  

A few good points made.  Be different and better than them.  

Brian Whitfield

  _____  

From: ajug-members-bounces at ajug.org [mailto:ajug-members-bounces at ajug.org]
On Behalf Of Dean H. Saxe
Sent: Thursday, August 02, 2007 5:24 PM
To: Keith Welch; General AJUG membership forum (100-200 messages/month)
Subject: Re: [ajug-members] Wipro coming to Atlanta

Have you read the book or are these just talking points from someone else?
Methinks you have an axe to grind... I'm stepping out of this. 

-dhs 

Dean H. Saxe, CISSP, CEH

dean at fullfrontalnerdity.com

"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds." 

--Einstein

On Aug 2, 2007, at 5:06 PM, Keith Welch wrote:

Friedman is an idiot, and a shill for the globalization lobby. There is NO
job in the U.S. that can't be done cheaper with foreign labor. Conceive some
great idea, and the first thing your investors are going to ask is how are
you going to make sure that the are no Americans employed. Does that mean
that we should tolerate this because it benefits the billionaires? God did
not bestow on them some divine right to wealth at your expense. Until then,
how do we feed our children? It will take a thousand years to bring
third-world income up to allow fair competition not based on the poverty of
billions.Vote people. Call you congressman. Raise hell. Vote. Contribute to
OUR lobby:

http://www.brightfuturejobs.org

-----Original Message----- 
From: "Dean H. Saxe" 
Sent: Aug 2, 2007 4:31 PM 
To: "General AJUG membership forum ((100-200 messages/month))" 
Subject: Re: [ajug-members] Wipro coming to Atlanta 

Keith, 

I'd highly recommend reading Thomas Friedman's _The World is Flat_.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_World_is_Flat

FWIW, companies are not tied down to location any longer, especially when it
comes to development. Whether Wipro is here or in CA or Timbuktu doesn't
matter. Other organizations need to find ways to compete against them or
find new lines of business that organizations like Wipro cannot compete in.
To think that keeping Wipro out of Atlanta or out of the US will stop
companies from seeking cheaper labor is wishful thinking. Companies don't,
and shouldn't IMHO, care where the work is done, only that it is done
correctly and for a fair price.

-dhs

Dean H. Saxe, CISSP, CEH

dean at fullfrontalnerdity.com

"To announce that there must be no criticism of the president, or that we
are to stand by the president right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and
servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public."

-- Theodore Roosevelt

On Aug 2, 2007, at 3:29 PM, Keith Welch wrote:

> If you can't compete in a global marketplace then perhaps its time to find
a new line of work

Now this is the kind of mindless slogan that we need to get rid of. Do you
understand how stupid this statement is? NONE of us can compete with
poverty. NONE of us can compete with people working where the median wage is
under $2,000 a year. Our dollar is worth 10 there. Go right ahead and try to
complete, go work for $1,999 a year somewhere. Are you inadequate because
you can't? No, you don't have the option of doing that, because you live in
a country where you need to make 10 times that just to eat. No amount of
getting better at your job is going to make a difference.

Accusing someone of being incompetent because he has to pay $20K a year just
in taxes more than the people that he has to compete? That just displays a
lack of basic empathy. Individuals aren't the ones supposed to be able to
"compete in a global marketplace". You can't. It is companies that are
supposed to. Don't parrot someone else's propaganda. Your paycheck is
already smaller because of this. I am amazed by the number of professionals
who understand what is happening to them.

Of course, I won't even dignify the statements that increasing the supply of
Java developers is somehow good for us with a rebuttal. Somebody must have
missed that day in business school when the law of supply and demand were
discussed.

-----Original Message----- 
From: "Dean H. Saxe" 
Sent: Aug 2, 2007 12:30 PM 
To: "General AJUG membership forum (100-200 messages/month)" 
Subject: Re: [ajug-members] Wipro coming to Atlanta 

I'm not exactly sure how this is bad for you, Brian. If you can't compete in
a global marketplace then perhaps its time to find a new line of work. (No,
I'm not targeting you in particular, I meant the statement in general.) 

I'd love if you can help me understand why this is bad news in your opinion.

-dhs

Dean H. Saxe, CISSP, CEH

dean at fullfrontalnerdity.com

"Great spirits have often encountered violent opposition from weak minds." 

--Einstein

On Aug 2, 2007, at 11:38 AM, Brian Whitfield / Essential Resources wrote:

Not entirely java unrelated (we'll compete with these guys for jobs)

http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic
<http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.do?command=viewArticleBasic&art
icleId=9027525> &articleId=9027525 

I don't consider this good news. You can bet most of them will not be local
Atlanta people that are hired. I've sent the GA congressman emails stating
we should fight this. Maybe all the ajug members should do the same. 

Brian Whitfield

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