Re: Certification

["Brian Lee" <brian_a_lee@hotmail.com>]

>A good worker in any profession is one who shows integrity, honesty, a good 
>work ethic, and is willing to forth their best while at work.

You are right but a great worker is all of the above plus spending their own 
time to learn new techs. Which is more attractive to a potential employer.

Not to be too offensive but unless you never watch tv, never read fiction, 
etc etc you have spare time. You just choose to use it differently. I would 
prefer to spend time with my child than poring over the latest j2ee acronym, 
but an employer may not.

Certs aren't that hard, they probably require about 40-80 hours spread out 
over however long you want and cost about $150-$300 (including study 
materials etc). If you "don't have time" to get get a cert on your own time 
then you have serious time management issues as 15 minutes a day for 6 
months should be accessible for anyone.

BAL

>From: "Jason R. Kretzer" <jason@OpinionOne.com>
>To: ajug-members@ajug.org
>Subject: Re: Certification
>Date: Mon, 04 Nov 2002 09:47:53 -0500
>
>I  have to disagree with this mentality.  You make it sound like people 
>without the time to learn on their own are not worth hiring.  I have a wife 
>and a new child.  Personally, I have the "desire to learn" but not the 
>"time" to learn.  I learn new technologies at work.  Since work is what the 
>new skills are for, I see no problem in this.  The idea that "we only want 
>people who will not only put in the 9 to 5 but will work for the company on 
>their own time as well.", is not the right way to judge candidates.  I have 
>a great desire for knowledge and extending my skills and I must take issue 
>with anyone who says that I don't show initiative(or have good programming 
>skills) because I won't use my family time for studying for a piece of 
>paper that says I knew how to memorize a book for a day.  A good worker in 
>any profession is one who shows integrity, honesty, a good work ethic, and 
>is willing to forth their best while at work.
>
>Sorry for the rant but I hate it when someone judges those without the time 
>to do stuff on their own time as somehow being lazy(not showing 
>initiative).
>
>-Jason
>
>
>
>
>Curt Smith wrote:
>
>>
>>>Think about the "desire to learn" part.  I would prefer to hire someone
>>>who has a constant fire in their person to learn new technologies in
>>>their spare time than someone that does just the 8-5 bit.
>>
>>
>>Dead on.  Too bad, but gone are the days of being a C programmer day
>>in and day out.  I judge the a candidate on the desire to learn
>>on their own time and initiative with questions like;  what books
>>have you read lately.  And by how _many_ certifications they have.
>>
>>Some folks might be surprised there's a few more java and OO oriented
>>certs besides SCJP.  :)  Personally I need the carrot to get me through
>>all the books and study, so collecting certs is one of my hobbies.  ;-(
>>My credit card shows alot of good books have been bought, read and
>>an immediate good use put that info (more credit card hits for the
>>cert tests) and more tears.
>>
>>I've found it to be almost as expensive as going to GA state.  Isn't
>>our industry forcing us through this type of re-education pratically
>>another degree every 2-3 years just to stay current?   BTW, the
>>JDJ mag / web site has a few comments about current state of complexity
>>and API breadth needed to be _called_ competent.  Hmmm.
>>
>>For example, EJB / JMS is pase, now it's UDDI, WSDL, doc. centric etc.
>>
>>Best of luck to all,
>>
>>curt
>>
>>


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