RE: Certification

[Eric Friedman <efried@bellsouth.net>]

I more or less agree with Vikrant. Certifications don't mean a lot but
they are filtering agents for HR. If it can help get you through HR,
why not?

One question about the Sun Java certs ... I am studying for the Programmers
certification and have a server side focus. Sun has 2 tests, 1.2 and 1.4. It looks
like 1.4 has dropped the io and awt packages and added some material about the
new assertion facility. Is that about it? Any other differences?

Thanks,

Eric

At 11:22 AM 11-4-2002, Vikrant.Verma@alltel.com wrote:
>certifications are extremely good filtering instruments for HR. We all
>will be forced to do these certification sooner or later. 
>
>Its easy entry for new commers to cram and give the certifications. Its
>also easy to see why so many qualified java certs are not even close on
>being good developers. They dont have experience, they have never faced
>the fire. But sooner or later there will be enough certified java
>developers that will be really good and then you will be asked to prove
>your worth. So why wait.
>
>Ironically we are now commodities in the thinking market.
>
>Be practical get one if you have time. The one of us who has most
>feature would sell. 
>my 0.02$
>-Vikrant
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Curt Smith [mailto:chsmith@speakeasy.net]
>Sent: Monday, November 04, 2002 11:02 AM
>To: Unlisted-recipients 
>Cc: ajug-members@ajug.org
>Subject: Re: Certification
>
>
>I hear the folks who want to spend personal time studying but
>don't have the time.  I know this first hand too.
>
>JDJ is hitting it on the head too.  To be a marketable
>candidate today, you really do need credible experience
>and knowledge in most of the APIs comprising J2EE 1.3.
>
>What are we to do?   It is sad, it's also a fact.  We
>can complain that we don't have time, but it won't change
>the above fact nor the minds of employers about the experience
>levels they expect for even entry positions.
>
>I'm sorry (honest) that my opinions may be unsettling
>but might this be a useful discussion so we might reflect
>on whether we need to re-adjust our carreer protection
>tactics or not?
>
><my-opinions>
>
>There's two ends of a spectrum of how one approaches their job in
>the java market:
>
>- laborer - the company pays for training, certs and books.  If they
>   don't pay, the laborer doesn't do anything out side of 8-5.
>
>- professional - the company is asked to pay nothing.  The
>   prfessional takes responsibility of their continuing education,
>   books and credible acknowledgements that they have succeeded
>   in their training efforts (degrees or certs).
>
>With so many good folks out of work, if you were hiring, which
>candidate type would you want to have on your team, backing up
>your reputation and project's success?
>
>I hear some folks study after the kids go to bed or some
>watch less tv...
>
>Me,, I dream of changing careers to land scaping and working
>only on sunny days and sleeping till noon when it's rainy.
>
>:)
>
>
>> Feel like listing the certs? 
>
>Beyond SCJP the following I feel were a value to study for
>and because the info is relavent are worth listing on a resume:
>
>- SC Web Component Developer  - solid coverage of JSP and Servlets
>
>- SC Enterrpise Architect - this cert. covers high level EJB,
>and OK coverage of architecture, OO, methodology, system design
>and system components and of course heavy on UML.
>
>My tip;  the content of this cert is almost 2 yrs old, is lighter
>coverage than you'd guess.   See some SCEA helps at javaranch,
>yahoo groups and this site:  javadepot.com
>
>Other vendors certs that I feel where a useful study experience:
>
>- IBM's  OOA&D and UML
>
>- Weblogic - Weblogic Server cert.  This was light on EJB and
>   heavy on cmd line args, administration and how to run and tune
>   details.  Useful actually even if you don't use WLS.  One of
>   devils of EJB is the evil deployment descriptor which you
>   you won't be affraid of anymore should you pass this one.
>
>:)
>
>
>Other certs that I wish I spent time on are:  Oracle DBA
>
>I find that to be a well rounded developer / designer I also
>need to be able to stop and start data bases, some tuning and
>be fairly good at writing functional and performant SQL and
>stored procs when the middle tier is not the highest perf.
>place for business logic.  (don't believe those nuts touting
>CMP-R for anything but demos and small systems that run 9-4
>on M-Th.  Fridays are evil for all apps and even some demos.)
>
></my-opinions>
>
>Take care, curt